Funny Scottish Shit

Okay, let's play it out.

Galloway, with the help of Aqu, Ian and their group make it into Glasgow city. They thereby revolt and attempt to take over our council. There is no assembled Gallowayian force ready to march on Glasgow before hand, to have such figures arrive in the city and then to assemble would be a clear indication of their intentions. Had Galloway intended to invade Glasgow, do think they'd have waited until Fury and the CA were mostly back home?

I'd have hit Glasgow at the first mention of the Fury armies engaging in the combat down there. There'll be a big fight when the forces start to return, but they have control of the county, they've the upper hand. This idea they intended to do it while Fury were home makes no sense. They're idiots, but come on.

Plotters were coming towards the city, aye. This part's fine and dandy, and no one from Galloway now knowing why is saying big bad Fury and CA killeded the innocent. They know they got what was coming with them.

But besides that, Galloway's council have done everything I've suggested to Evan, perhaps not to the same degree, but if they have any sense, they'll be kicking out Ian to England.

After that point, it's more about Fury and Campbells being able to talk, not so much Galloway and Glasgow, the councils' from what Sinthas has told were working fine together, he'd seen the mailings from Jules, and got worried. But besides that, and Ian, things have actually been rather dead and peaceful.

Again, no fan of Galloway, lets hit them if they actually do something. But lets be honest, the moment that Galloway and Glasgow go for each others throats, we're going to end up with a Fret situation in Scotland, and no one wins one of those, and keeps the county populated at the end.

Actually no one knew when the CA would be sailing home, and in my view, the plotters wanted enough soldiers and warships to be able to repel the CA when they did (which is why the plotters waited).  Unfortunately for those wanting to force the CA out of Galloway, the CA headed home, and they failed to get the support they wanted in France or Brittany (at least as far as we know, maybe they did make a deal with the Frets and we will all end up paying for it).

I don't want to see a war either, but Galloway needs to see that putting a Campbell on the throne, that hates Fury and the CA, is a very, very bad idea, and both counties need to agree on monarch candidates they will support.  That way no one with an axe to grind in Scotland will have the monarch title to use in diplomacy aboard.  While Scotland may not put much value in the monarch, those on the continent do, and assume everyone else does, so it gives the person in that seat great diplomatic reach.

anto_capone wrote:

Jurias wrote:

Fitz wrote:

For the Irish players. Just want to point out that Ian.de.brus has been charged in Galloway's Court with impersonating an elected official and has pleaded guilty. Additionally, Evan, Duke of Galloway, has raised a public discussion to ban or otherwise arm against Pit and his ilk from entering Galloway.

Does seem logical that the county would try to cover their asses once they plan was found out and it could no longer be effective. Now they're under threat of being demolished. It's what I'd do...

"Oh no, look! We're innocent! We would never condone such atrocious things!"

You aren't going to roll over, with no hope in hell of winning and admit everything.

What were they supposed to do? If someone in Chonnacht was doing the same, then that sounds like about what I would do...

I don't understand most of the rhetoric here.

What Galloway is supposed to do ? Surrender and bring us something that we would like in order to make up for the mess they did bring to us.

Spring wrote:

Actually no one knew when the CA would be sailing home

We did in Scotland, Angel's coming home thread said the Fury folks were near by water at the very, the rest of the CA, not so much.

Sinthas says they've known about Ian and this nonsense since the twenty third of May, it's now the end of June, so either no one sent forces to support Ian, Galloway didn't want them in their county, or it's been a false flag over a guy who brags about this size of his tiny toenails.



Considering her Husband is actually quite positive towards the CA, wouldn't stop talking about how Galloway was idiotic not to join the CA or something to that effect when we had him working the mines during their last attack. Either a screw's loose or I've slept through more mud slinging than I can imagine. His post that got removed makes me think he hasn't the foggiest over the Ian nonsense. Either, he's great at playing the idiot, or doesn't realise the situation.

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both counties need to agree on monarch candidates they will support.

Won't happen, simple. The type of player base in Glasgow is different to the one in Galloway. One does nothing with the crown, the other gives out fancy titles and the likes. Unless the Queens giving out a proclamation saying burn all the Irish and Glaswegians.

It's again all boiling down to that stupid Englishman pretending to be a Scot, knew I didn't like him from the start for a reason. Anyone who gives themselves the name Bruce is an arsehole to me.

WhiteSnow wrote:

anto_capone wrote:

Jurias wrote:

Fitz wrote:

For the Irish players. Just want to point out that Ian.de.brus has been charged in Galloway's Court with impersonating an elected official and has pleaded guilty. Additionally, Evan, Duke of Galloway, has raised a public discussion to ban or otherwise arm against Pit and his ilk from entering Galloway.

Does seem logical that the county would try to cover their asses once they plan was found out and it could no longer be effective. Now they're under threat of being demolished. It's what I'd do...

"Oh no, look! We're innocent! We would never condone such atrocious things!"

You aren't going to roll over, with no hope in hell of winning and admit everything.

What were they supposed to do? If someone in Chonnacht was doing the same, then that sounds like about what I would do...

I don't understand most of the rhetoric here.

What Galloway is supposed to do ? Surrender and bring us something that we would like in order to make up for the mess they did bring to us.

So you want a county that isn't fighting to surrender and then you want to extort said county? All in the good name of cooperation, eh?

Galloway doesnt understand what neutrality or peace does mean.

Tam, it can be done. Give each council veto power on monarch candidates for each election. And if the councils can't agree that any of the candidates are benign, then neither council uses their votes for any of them. It's not that hard. The treaty requires the councils to work together. If they can't work together on an acceptable monarch the treaty may as well be thrown out now, because it's useless.

Another thing is that Galloway should make a law against their citizens recruiting in Glasgow.  Then if JO keeps up, he would be charged in Galloway court, and punished.  It's wrong for anyone in Galloway to be recruiting Glasgow's newborns, and that needs to stop.

As for knowing when the CA was very close to home, yes, they knew a few days ahead, but the CA and Glasgow council knew of the plot for much longer, and it was decided to wait and have everyone home and settled back in before getting this issue addressed.

I agree Dry, Galloway should talk to Glasgow, and make amends.  The actions of Ian (and whoever he was working with) cost Glasgow, so it's only fair that something be done to make that up to Glasgow.

BS, Ian cost Glasgow what? Sleepless nights having RK nightmares and the joy of getting to kill Ian after Kat missed her chance at sea?

Spring wrote:

Tam, it can be done. Give each council veto power on monarch candidates for each election. And if the councils can't agree that any of the candidates are benign, then neither council uses their votes for any of them. It's not that hard. The treaty requires the councils to work together. If they can't work together on an acceptable monarch the treaty may as well be thrown out now, because it's useless.

There hasn't been a case of a King/Queen going rouge since Rothar and the Frets, now. If there was any justification besides the old Fury/Campbell feud going here, there might be a point. But other than curbing the freedom of both Glasgow and Galloway, will such a law do? Galloway for example has the bigger population, if we cut out and apply that law, say both counties refuse to use their votes, Galloway's still going to win. It's just the way it is with such a broken system.

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Another thing is that Galloway should make a law against their citizens recruiting in Glasgow.

That would require a legal treaty between Glasgow and Galloway, something that lacks due to either side not wanting to go after their own. Wouldn't do Fury any good to need to prosecute their own people robbing in Glasgow, nor Galloway for when the Campbells go chasing Fury... Though I have been saying for a while now it would be useful in calming things down.

Quote :

As for knowing when the CA was very close to home, yes, they knew a few days ahead, but the CA and Glasgow council knew of the plot for much longer, and it was decided to wait and have everyone home and settled back in before getting this issue addressed.

So Ian came up north, knowing his window of opportunity had vanished, knew that Fury were back Glasgow and the capital nonetheless - a post in our hall said Dry would help a manison being built -. If were meaning to be effective against Glasgow, why do they keep shooting themselves in the foot?

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The actions of Ian (and whoever he was working with) cost Glasgow, so it's only fair that something be done to make that up to Glasgow.

He's currently on trial for treason down in Galloway, depending on the sentencing we'll know for sure. If the judge has any sense they'll try and get the names of the others out of them, least they look culpable.

WhiteSnow wrote:

anto_capone wrote:

Jurias wrote:

Fitz wrote:

For the Irish players. Just want to point out that Ian.de.brus has been charged in Galloway's Court with impersonating an elected official and has pleaded guilty. Additionally, Evan, Duke of Galloway, has raised a public discussion to ban or otherwise arm against Pit and his ilk from entering Galloway.

Does seem logical that the county would try to cover their asses once they plan was found out and it could no longer be effective. Now they're under threat of being demolished. It's what I'd do...

"Oh no, look! We're innocent! We would never condone such atrocious things!"

You aren't going to roll over, with no hope in hell of winning and admit everything.

What were they supposed to do? If someone in Chonnacht was doing the same, then that sounds like about what I would do...

I don't understand most of the rhetoric here.

What Galloway is supposed to do ? Surrender and bring us something that we would like in order to make up for the mess they did bring to us.

Ok, that sounds fine, but can you elaborate on what exactly is the mess they brought to you? Not being facetious, but everything to me seems intact on your end. What are they supposed to surrender? I don't see any ongoing war or battles. What are they supposed to bring?

There is a slight difference between tribute and compensation. One is a demand that precedes an offensive action, the other is a demand that succeeds and offensive action. As with any mediation or arbitration, it is important to honestly state what you actually want, so it can be negotiated. If neither side is willing to negotiate, then there is no point.

A lot of this reminds me of my interactions with KoW in somewhat recent times. I could have went to war with them, and dragged you all in it, but instead I negotiated with them and both sides were happy. I simply think, that when it comes to your own backyard, it is best to avoid burning any bridges if possible. Otherwise you will always be looking over your back, you won't be able to ever leave without risking your home, and you just end up damaging each other.

Scotland's past is no big mystery, I mean just recently Julius was marching an army through Glasgow and attacking people. So, I can understand being defensive. I think it is right and good to call this out and ask for accountability. I just wonder what it will ever take for you guys to not be at each others throats for once? I see there is no love lost between you guys, but I think even Galloway would admit any plans on attacking Glasgow would lead only to their own demise. The CA would crush Galloway with just 1/4 of our forces.

What would it take for you guys to just co-exist respectfully and peacefully? Because attempted extermination of either side would weaken us all. That would only benefit England, would it not? So I just want to see the logic in all of this so I can better understand it.
I think it goes without saying that if some English or French troops show up in Galloway, or anyone else shows up with a plan or design to attack Glasgow; well that will be the last scheme they ever devise. There is no fleet, there is no army, there is no economy that can match the might of the CA. That's just plain numbers.

I simply do want that Galloway would stay away from us. I do have to sit and wait till they finally will get their act together and hit us ?

I agree anto, but Galloway needs to start policing their own, and when they fail the county needs to pay up.  That's the only way those down their might stop this crazy attack mentality.  If it costs their own county for their actions, then at least they have a reason to stop.  And it's clear, they do need a reason to stop, because they clearly haven't.

Tam, cooperation on monarch elections is possible, a higher population makes no difference, voting for a monarch costs money to regular people, and few, if any, actually pay it.  The free ballots go to the councils, mayors, priests, etc.  Galloway has more of those, so that's their advantage.  If Glasgow has a veto on Galloway's council votes, and Galloway has veto of Glasgow's, then together if they agree on a candidate and vote for them, that's who would be elected.  It's really that simple, and the treaty requires such cooperation.

As for Galloway making a law against their citizens recruiting in Glasgow, there is no need for a judicial treaty to to make that law.  The sending of the mail is being done in Galloway, so Galloway can police their own, and Glasgow can send evidence of law violations, if they choose to do so.  Those in Galloway need to stop interfering in Glasgow, and leave them be.  That's the only way to lasting peace.

I think Galloway and Glasgow need to sit down and talk this out.  Something needs to be done so Galloway and all of their citizens respect the peace.  Glasgow can't be a target in any way, and no one from Galloway can be allowed to cause unrest or attacks in Glasgow.  That's just wrong.

Well Dry,you could make friends with the rest of Galloway instead of threatening them.  That would push enemies of Glasgow to the periphery of society making them much easier to eliminate as threats...just sayin

I actually think its easier to eliminate them all

Maybe...but that just puts us back into the endless cycle of tit for tat. Doesn't sound like something someone that truly wanted peace would do...eliminating over 300 people could get quite messy

Springtime wrote:

I agree anto, but Galloway needs to start policing their own, and when they fail the county needs to pay up.

They seem to have arrested the person being inciting the violence. I'm not sure what other cost of damages there could be beside the cost of the soldiers who rallied to fight the guy. So, put a dollar value on it, and then negotiate, right?

Whitesnow wrote:

I actually think its easier to eliminate them all

Funny, but you do realize that is not only pretty much impossible, but it would hurt us more than it hurts them?

Take over Galloway, make it a colony, crush it into dirt- but where do all the instigators end up? Right across the border in England and still in your backyard.

Didn't we learn this from Munster? Those guys are all sitting pretty in England with more protection now than they ever had when they were in Ireland. At least with those guys, they aren't in our backyard. I don't see a mass exodus from Galloway leading anywhere other than England.

Elimination is not only impractical, it is impossible. Even England has learned this much, they have given up on trying to 'destroy the NNGO!' rhetoric. You can't make people quit the game. Even if you could- would you really want to?

So what would it take? Just the fact that Galloway council is speaking here tells me they are at very least worried and want to avoid a war.

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